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  <id>tag:,2008:/1/tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-</id>
  <updated>2008-07-03T08:54:01Z</updated>
  <title>Comments for 2008 Web Predictions</title>
  
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    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413</id>
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    <link rel="service.edit" type="application/atom+xml" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/cgi-bin/mt/mt-atom.cgi/weblog/blog_id=1/entry_id=5413" title="Could P2P Networks Enable a Google Killer?" />
    <published>2008-01-09T20:40:20Z</published>
    <updated>2008-01-09T20:50:36Z</updated>
    <title>Could P2P Networks Enable a Google Killer?</title>
    <summary> Word association: P2P = Napster = disrupted the music industry. P2P technology certainly did that. Skype shook up telecoms and Joost may do the same for TV. P2P (Peer to Peer) networks could be a lot more. They could be the last big disruptive technology online. The online world is increasingly getting divided into...</summary>
    <author>
      <name>Bernard Lunn</name>
      <uri>http://bernardlunn.wordpress.com</uri>
    </author>
    
    <category term="Trends" />
    
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.readwriteweb.com/">
      <![CDATA[ <p><img src="http://www.readwriteweb.com/images/gnutella_logo_mar07.jpg" />Word association: P2P = Napster = <a href="http://sethgodin.typepad.com/seths_blog/2008/01/music-lessons.html">disrupted the music industry</a>. P2P technology certainly did that. Skype shook up telecoms and Joost may do the same for TV.</p>

<p>P2P (Peer to Peer) networks could be a lot more. They could be the last big disruptive technology online. The online world is increasingly getting divided into a few mega firms that can afford to invest billions in server farms (Google, Amazon, Microsoft, Yahoo, eBay) and the rest of us. Start-ups may love to have that &#8220;pay as you go infrastructure&#8221;, but it does create a huge barrier between the big league and everybody else.</p>]]>
      <![CDATA[<p>It almost makes you want to love that old kludgy PC. For all its myriad faults, the PC was/is a great leveler; we all get the same tools at our disposal. I like the freedom and lack of hassle from having it all out there &#8220;in the cloud&#8221;; but there is a nagging concern that somebody will hold me hostage to all that. We are already seeing what happens when somebody wants to <a href="http://scobleizer.com/2008/01/03/ive-been-kicked-off-of-facebook/">get their data out of Facebook</a>.</p>
<p>It is now accepted wisdom that the <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/from_search_to_research.php">search game is over and Google has won</a>. Wikia, one of the well-funded attempts to take on Google, launched to a <a href="http://rickfu.com/2008/01/07/wikia-launch-the-internet-is-displeased/">chorus of boos</a>. I took a look at Powerset, another well-funded and well-hyped attempt, using natural language search and was seriously underwhelmed. <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/microsoft_fast_takeover.php">Microsoft buying FAST</a> for $1.2bn will make some enterprise $$$ but won&#8217;t impact the broad consumer market.</p>

<p>The barriers are not search algorithms. That&#8217;s easy. The first barrier is overcoming habit. I think that a genuinely better alternative will change habits. That worked for Google and with search boxes having multiple alternatives it really is simple to switch.</p>
<p>The second barrier is that success requires investing $$$ billions in server farms. Now that VCs have pumped money into lots of attempts and they are not seeming to get much traction we are entering a phase where nobody will put significant new money behind a search venture. This is like the decade or so when nobody would invest to challenge Microsoft.</p>
<p>That is bad news for everybody. It creates a <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monoculture#Computer_science">monoculture</a> and that&#8217;s always bad.</p>
<p>P2P networks are the only way to overcome that second barrier, avoiding the need for $$$ billions in server farms. P2P uses the infrastructure of the users.</p>
<p>I like the look of <a href="http://www.faroo.com/">Faroo</a>, the Peer to Peer Web Search company. There are some side benefits related to privacy and SEO spam control, but the core advantage of P2P for search is a very simple economic proposition. Because Faroo don&#8217;t need to invest in server farms they can return 50% of the search revenue to users. My guess is that models will evolve that give way more than 50% back to users. The payoff from scale without need to invest in scale is so enormous that ventures would be wise to give back whatever it takes to get scale. That is simple <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/platform_power_show_me_the_money.php">&#8220;show me the money&#8221;</a>.</p>

<p>Project out a few years of Internet growth and the basic economics of a centralized index start to look a bit suspect. How big can those server farms get?</p>
<p>I am not qualified to decide whether P2P networks can scale. There is plenty of well-informed debate online on this subject. I do know that my Skype button shows over 10m users online right now; so I am inclined to believe those who say that P2P networks can scale.</p>
<p>Of course, Faroo suffers from the mother of all chicken and egg problems.  Their model is based on indexing the sites that all the Faroo searchers visit. Until that number is measured in millions it will be a useless service. Faroo is clearly aware of this issue but I am not sure they have a good answer for it.</p>
<p>So the real breakthrough may come from one of the existing P2P networks. The problem here looks like a <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peer-to-peer">mind-boggling array of alternatives,</a> each of which has their ardent admirers. This is one area where de factor standardization would help. As long as the P2P winner is open source who cares who wins? There is no toll gate being erected.</p>
<p>It would then be possible to layer a Faroo like search application on top. The basic functionality of a search engine is not complex. The network effect is what matters.</p>
<p>One company that may have some of the pieces is <a href="http://www.limewire.com/about/">Limewire</a>. It is open source, runs on the Gnutella network, it is spyware free (they monetize on a freemium model, with an upgrade to a paid Pro edition) and seems to be backed by a stable company.</p>

<p>Another company that could make a play here is Sun. After all, P2P is totally in synch with their ever-prescient &#8220;the network is the computer&#8221;. That has a better ring than &#8220;the server farm is the computer&#8221;. If Sun enabled this next disruptive wave they would re-gain their relevance at the center of the IT industry.</p>
<p>The P2P model puts data back on our hard drives. That means fixing the data management, security and other issues that continue to plague PCs. But that would be a small price for re-gaining control over our data. Social networks believe that my data is an asset for them to sell to advertisers (in return for some simple features). I disagree and so do many other people. This is a visceral issue. Its my data, dammit. P2P puts data back in user&#8217;s control.</p>
<p>Surprisingly, there is very little buzz about P2P today. Searching on P2P gets posts/articles that are mostly 2001/2002 vintage. So I am sure nobody will Digg this post or comment on it. But I do harbor a suspicion that the one big disruptive play in search will come from P2P.</p>]]>
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  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45030</id>
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    <title>Comment from CasaMan on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>CasaMan</name>
        <uri></uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="">
        <![CDATA[<p>Google invested a lot of money on huge data centers all around the world.. Namely because these data centers can guarantee speed. Google can offer blazingly fast results. Less than a second for any query. People like that, it's one of the best features of google.  A p2p search engine can and will never be able to do provide such fast serps. (think all the latency between peers). A p2p network might be great for spidering and data analyzing. But then again, that's more about the cycles than the network.</p>

<p>Check out this great video explaining Google's grid:<br />
<a href="http://www.uwtv.org/programs/displayevent.aspx?rID=3898" rel="nofollow">http://www.uwtv.org/programs/displayevent.aspx?rID=3898</a><br />
</p>]]>
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    <published>2008-01-09T22:06:15Z</published>
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  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45033</id>
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    <title>Comment from Wolf on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>Wolf</name>
        <uri>http://www.faroo.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.faroo.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>> A p2p search engine can and will never be able to <br />
> do provide such fast serps.</p>

<p>"Transmission of documents via telephone wires is possible in principle, but the apparatus required is so expensive that it will never become a practical proposition."<br />
-- Dennis Gabor, British physicist and author of Inventing the Future, 1962</p>

<p>“heavier-than-air flying machines are impossible” <br />
-- Lord Kelvin, Irish mathematical physicist, 1895 </p>

<p>Best regards,<br />
Wolf ;-)</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-09T22:43:05Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45039</id>
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    <title>Comment from CasaMan on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>CasaMan</name>
        <uri></uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="">
        <![CDATA[<p>@wolf<br />
Touché.. Guess i'm not that great of a visionair i thought i was.. :P <br />
</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-09T23:36:04Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45040</id>
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    <title>Comment from Madhu on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>Madhu</name>
        <uri>http://simile.wordpress.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://simile.wordpress.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>There might never be a <b>Google "killer",</b>, but someone might make search irrelevant / insignificant problem of the web, thus developing a google <strong>"ignore-r"</strong>.</p>

<p>In real world, when we want :<br />
1. a good dress<br />
2. a nice car<br />
3. a great friend</p>

<p>and like, we don't search, we explore. Google doesn't do this well. </p>

<p><i>Meaningful explore model integrated in all the applications / web sites we use, could be one such "ignore-r" of Google.</i></p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T00:18:25Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45042</id>
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    <title>Comment from PEERmadman on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>PEERmadman</name>
        <uri>http://www.peermadness.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.peermadness.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>People are going to get (read: are already) fed-up with the online advertising "model" that so many companies are trying to push down user's throats.  Eventually these services will die off and cleaner, more "socialable" entities will take their place.  It's a pendulum.  First there was server where too much of the functionality was on the server, then client-server where too much of the functionality was on the client, back to the web where too much of the functionality is on any single service.  In order for the internet to take the next measurable jump in usefulness, the disparate technologies that provide the intenet services will need to become more cohesive and a definable relationship between the users that is more natural and free-flowing than binary "friend/not friend" will need to be established.</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T00:41:16Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45043</id>
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    <title>Comment from Mick Liubinskas on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>Mick Liubinskas</name>
        <uri>http://wheel.blogs.com/makingwebapps/</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://wheel.blogs.com/makingwebapps/">
        <![CDATA[<p>I worked for Kazaa and we came to understand a lot about the power of P2P for the distribution of data. Skype and Joost are examples of what you can do when you understand P2P and can execute it in a world class way. It's certainly not easy, but it's certainly young. </p>

<p>I'd like to see more open source work on underlying technologies and perhaps some API's to encourage innovation in P2P use. </p>

<p>To think that P2P was all about Napster and music would be to say that the Internet is all about webpages. </p>

<p>Nice piece. </p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T00:51:28Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45046</id>
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    <title>Comment from Christian Decker on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>Christian Decker</name>
        <uri>http://blog.snyke.net</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://blog.snyke.net">
        <![CDATA[<p>Great article, I'm sending my beta application to Faroo right now, but the main reason is that it bothers me that you write "de factor" which is correctly spelled "de facto", sorry for being such a know it all, but latin is my passion ^^</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T01:14:15Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45049</id>
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    <title>Comment from Lucas Gonze on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>Lucas Gonze</name>
        <uri>http://gonze.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://gonze.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>Extracting semantics from search data sets requires processing all those spidered web pages using matrix operations.  These gigantic matrices have to be traversed over and over again, very large numbers of times.  The computations are staggeringly huge compared to typical PC operations.  </p>

<p>A cluster which is capable of running this kind of job is extremely sensitive to latency, which is the time for data to travel between machines.  If the datasets are spread across the open internet, especially in a network as flukey and widely variable as a P2P network containing everything down to 28.8 modems, the additional latency will make the computations impossible.    Just to give one example of the problems, processing a spidering run will take so much longer that query results from a P2P search engine will be way out of date in comparison to commercial search engines.</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T03:07:03Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45050</id>
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    <title>Comment from Brian Edwards on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>Brian Edwards</name>
        <uri>http://neokast.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://neokast.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>The future of the web is video, and the future of video is P2P streaming technology that is buffer-free and in HD quality.  The most advanced technology for providing this technology to bloggers, artists, students, politicians and anyone else is developed by Evanston, IL based <a href="http://neokast.com" rel="nofollow">Neokast</a>. Utilizing P2P software designed by a Northwestern Ph.D. candidate, Neokast has the potential to give everyone the power to create a true 24/7 streaming network of content that is bound only by producers imaginations.   </p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T03:29:26Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45052</id>
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    <title>Comment from Ash Maurya on 2008-01-09</title>
    <author>
        <name>Ash Maurya</name>
        <uri>http://www.wiredjournal.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.wiredjournal.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>Having spent the last several years delivering P2P solutions, I've come to the opinion that unless there is a super compelling value proposition (Kazaa - FREE music, Skype - FREE calls, Joost - FREE TV), mass P2P adoption is really hard because of the "software download" tax. </p>

<p>Even if Faroo does manage to index millions of sites, will enough "regular" users download it to make it work? Yes, everything is cyclical, and one day, maybe, we might all go back to the desktop app but today the browser is the universal app. I really believe a lot more can be gained by embracing a hybrid P2Web model that leverages the best from P2P (efficiency, scalability) and the web (ubiquity, simplicity). One such framework (we're working on) is <a href="http://www.cloudstack.com" rel="nofollow">CloudStack</a>. </p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T04:33:39Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45062</id>
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    <title>Comment from Endre Jofoldi on 2008-01-10</title>
    <author>
        <name>Endre Jofoldi</name>
        <uri>http://www.allplus.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.allplus.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>I already tried Faroo, and the biggest problem with it is really the size of the index. So your proposed solution that they should include themselves with an other existing P2P application like Skype would be the solution to this problem.<br />
</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T12:30:31Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45067</id>
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    <title>Comment from Mark V on 2008-01-10</title>
    <author>
        <name>Mark V</name>
        <uri></uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="">
        <![CDATA[<p>p2p is probably a good way to index the deep web, that is, everything on your computer or intranet that you would be willing to expose to the rest of the world. Simply select what you want to index, share the index with some centralized tracker and let it update as your data changes.</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T13:51:09Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45087</id>
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    <title>Comment from Jean-Baptiste on 2008-01-10</title>
    <author>
        <name>Jean-Baptiste</name>
        <uri>http://www.TheIssue.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.TheIssue.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>Hey Bernard, <br />
Very nice article. I've featured it today in  <br />
<a href="www.TheIssue.com" rel="nofollow">The Issue's</a> Science and Health Section. You can find a brief excerpt and link back to the post. </p>

<p>Cheers</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-10T16:45:37Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.5413-comment:45568</id>
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    <title>Comment from Liders on 2008-01-21</title>
    <author>
        <name>Liders</name>
        <uri>http://www.3303.ru</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.3303.ru">
        <![CDATA[<p>I'd like to see more open source work on underlying technologies and perhaps some API's to encourage innovation in P2P use. </p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-01-21T11:14:02Z</published>
  </entry>

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