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  <id>tag:,2009:/1/tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-</id>
  <updated>2009-10-30T14:11:49Z</updated>
  <title>Comments for Next Gen Apps Won&apos;t Be Pushed Around By the Browser</title>
  
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  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356</id>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php" />
    <link rel="service.edit" type="application/atom+xml" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/cgi-bin/mt/mt-atom.cgi/weblog/blog_id=1/entry_id=6356" title="Next Gen Apps Won't Be Pushed Around By the Browser" />
    <published>2008-05-20T21:46:48Z</published>
    <updated>2008-05-21T19:57:20Z</updated>
    <title>Next Gen Apps Won&apos;t Be Pushed Around By the Browser</title>
    <summary>Next Gen Apps Outside the Browser</summary>
    <author>
      <name>Marshall Kirkpatrick</name>
      <uri>http://www.readwriteweb.com</uri>
    </author>
    
    <category term="Analysis" />
    
    <category term="Features" />
    
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.readwriteweb.com/">
      <![CDATA[<p><img alt="rainbowpic.jpg" src="http://www.readwriteweb.com/images/rainbowpic.jpg" width="150" height="118">The invention of the browser was a huge boon to the internet and a substantial amount of computing now goes on through that interface we've grown to love.  The internet is not a place where innovation takes a break, though, and a new generation of applications are emerging that have a different relationship with the web browser.</p>]]>
      <![CDATA[<p>From taking control of the browser to connecting to the web outside of it, there are a number of new strategies being implemented by startups these days.  In the following post we discuss seven different ways that new apps are telling browsers "you 'aint the boss of me now!" Some you'll be familiar with, but some you may not be.</p>

<p>If you'd like to discuss any of the following examples in real time with other readers, and see where their mouses are going on the page while you're reading, click on the button below.  Details about this at the end of the article!<br />
<center><script language="javascript" src="http://static.onfirefly.com/button_ex.js"></script>  </center></p>

<h2>Offline Syncing</h2>

<p>Web connectivity is approaching ubiquity for urban web users in the developed world, but there are a number of reasons that off-line access to web content is gaining momentum.  Wireless coverage is often spotty, EVDO is expensive and often under-performs, air travel requires working offline for now and it's just nice to have a local copy of content that you can use without going online.</p>

<p><a href="http://gears.google.com">Google Gears</a> is the best known way that apps are going offline and it's not just Google apps that use the platform to download content and sync back up when connectivity returns.  Web office <a href="http://zoho.com">Zoho</a> offers Gears support for offline use of its tools, for example, as does the handsome mind mapping tool <a href="http://www.mindmeister.com/">MindMeister</a>.  Google Gears also has a mobile component. Some apps at least have had initial problems with the fidelity of the syncs back online - syncing anything is hard.</p>

<p>Here's an hour-long nerd-a-thon from last month, titled "What's New in Google Gears."  If you're interested in a detailed status check on Gears, this is a fun little video to watch.</p>

<center><object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/xV_22e-Y5OE&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/xV_22e-Y5OE&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object></center>  

<p>It's not just Google doing offline synching.  Application development framework <a href="http://etelos.com">Etelos</a> recently rolled out the capability to <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/etelos_goes_offline2.php">take any app offline</a>, including enterprise installs of Google Apps, MediaWiki and WordPress.</p>

<p>The new Firefox 3 is also <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/firefox_3_offline_apps.php">offering offline support for web apps in general</a>, though the apps will need to be re-engineered in order for this to be truly viable.  Firefox 3 is still in beta, but I use the current version exclusively and it's great on a Mac.  Zimbra is available using Firefox's early offline support, you can read about <a href="http://starkravingfinkle.org/blog/2007/02/firefox-3-offline-app-demo/">the newest developments here</a>.</p>

<p>Sometimes, though, it's good when you're offline to just be alone with your thoughts for awhile, or pay attention to your non-electronic surroundings.</p>

<h2>Rich Internet Apps - RIAs</h2>

<p>Rich Internet Apps are applications that run on the desktop, outside of the browser, but utilize web connectivity for sending and recieving information.  They've got the speed and responsiveness of a desktop app, combined with the read/write capabilities of a web app.  </p>

<p>Adobe's AIR platform is the most popular system for building consumer level RIAs so far and there are some really beautiful ones available allready.  In addition to the best Twitter clients (AIR apps like <a href="http://twhirl.org">Twhirl</a>, <a href="http://getsnitter.com/">Snitter</a> and <a href="http://funkatron.com/spaz">Spaz</a> there are also many other applications being developed as RIAs.  Check out the very cool directory site <a href="http://freshairapps.com/">FreshAIR Apps</a> for a taste of what else is being done in this space.<br />
<center><em>Adobe's Thermo is a show stealer.</em></center><center><object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/lGdr3dCmxe4&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/lGdr3dCmxe4&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object></center></p>

<p>If you're interested in a deep dive into the world of RIAs, check out <a href="http://redmonk.com">Redmonk's</a> podcast series <a href="http://redmonk.libsyn.com/index.php?post_category=riaweekly">RIA Weekly</a>.</p>

<h2>Single App Browsers</h2>

<p>Site specific browsers are a new direction being explored by a company called <a href="http://fluidapp.com">Fluid</a>.  Why would you want a single app browser?   It's nice to be able to work with a particular application outside of your primary browser, just for ease of use, but there are even more reasons than that.  Fluid allows a high degree of customization, including easy implementation of Greasemonkey user scripts.  Check out the screencast video below. </p>

<center>
<object width="400" height="251">	<param name="allowfullscreen" value="true" />	<param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always" />	<param name="movie" value="http://www.vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_id=1003438&amp;server=www.vimeo.com&amp;show_title=1&amp;show_byline=1&amp;show_portrait=0&amp;color=&amp;fullscreen=1" />	<embed src="http://www.vimeo.com/moogaloop.swf?clip_id=1003438&amp;server=www.vimeo.com&amp;show_title=1&amp;show_byline=1&amp;show_portrait=0&amp;color=&amp;fullscreen=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" allowscriptaccess="always" width="400" height="251"></embed></object><br /><a href="http://www.vimeo.com/1003438?pg=embed&sec=1003438">Desktop Clients via Fluid</a> from <a href="http://www.vimeo.com/user328540?pg=embed&sec=1003438">Todd Ditchendorf</a> on <a href="http://vimeo.com?pg=embed&sec=1003438">Vimeo</a>.</center>

<p>I use a <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/muxtape_with_coverflow.php">Fluid version of social music site Muxtape</a> daily and just now began fantazising about putting Google Reader in its own Single App Browser.</p>

<h2>Screencasting/sharing</h2>

<p>Few things combine "wow" factor with utility as much as a good screensharing app.  While there are a number of good paid options (Webex and Adobe Breeze) there are also a growing number of free ways to show someone else your desktop or look at theirs.  While most screensharing apps require both parties to download a desktop client, one popular alternative is <a href="http://www.yuuguu.com">Yuuguu</a>.  This app lets the viewing party use a tab in their browser to watch the presenting party's desktop.  It's really easy to use and is great for providing tech support or tutorials.</p>

<p>Presenter downloads are available for Windows and for Mac.  I've had one problem broadcasting to a viewer using Windows, but generally speaking it's worked great.</p>

<h2>Greasemonkey</h2>

<p>Greasemonkey is an easy way to add all kinds of functionality to existing web pages by adding simple javascript plug-ins to your Firefox browser.  It takes five minutes and zero technical skills to use.  First install <a href="https://addons.mozilla.org/firefox/addon/748">Greasemonkey</a>, then peruse a world of plug-in options.  There are hundreds of scripts to chose from at <a href="http://userscripts.org">Userscripts.org</a> but our own Sarah Perez highlighted a list of <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/greasemonkey_scripts_for_the_s.php">some of the best for heavy social media users</a> earlier this month.  Unfortunately some of those scripts don't seem to work with the new Firefox 3 yet.  See also the fabulous Gina Trapani's collection of Gmail scripts called <a href="http://lifehacker.com/software/gmail/lifehacker-code-better-gmail-firefox-extension-251923.php">Better Gmail</a>.  I just used it to add a number of new features to Gmail and am quite happy about it.  See also <a href="http://userstyles.org/styles/5867">GMail Redesigned</a>, which isn't Greasemonkey - it's just using the browser's own CSS options to redesign GMail.  That looks even better.</p>

<p>Check out this very, very charming video about "fixing the web with Greasemonkey."  It's pretty cool.</p>

<center><object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/8hghpuxCHTc&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/8hghpuxCHTc&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object></center>

<h2>Total Browser Pwnage</h2>

<p><em>Firefly</em></p>

<p>The above apps are cool, but there's a whole other level of control that some new apps give you over the browser.  We eagerly anticipate seeing more apps like the following.</p>

<p>What is this strange orange haze that many of you have been reading this post through?   If you hadn't above you can <a href="javascript:void(0)" onClick="FIREFLY.open_firefly(); return false;">open fireflywith this link</a>.   (RSS readers can <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php">click through to check this out</a>)  It's a simple little app called <a href="http://firef.ly/">Firefly</a>.  First demonstrated by on Dave Winer's <a href="http://www.scripting.com/stories/2008/05/13/demoOfFirefly.html">Scripting.com</a>, it's a handy little bit of javascript that creates an interesting social browsing and chat experience.  </p>

<p><em>Iterasi</em></p>

<p><a href="http://iterasi.com">Iterasi</a> (disclosure: consulting client) is a plug-in that captures the exact content of a browser at a given moment in time, including AJAX states and forms.  The saved content is then stashed in a personal online archive that can be searched inside of, shared with other people by email or embedded in a blog post.  <br />
<center><object classid="clsid:D27CDB6E-AE6D-11cf-96B8-444553540000" width="437" height="333" id="viddler"><param name="movie" value="http://www.viddler.com/player/93866484/" /><param name="allowScriptAccess" value="always" /><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true" /><embed src="http://www.viddler.com/player/93866484/" width="437" height="333" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowScriptAccess="always" allowFullScreen="true" name="viddler" ></embed></object></center></p>

<p>While it's Windows only right now, as soon as there's a Mac version I look forward to using it to save legal forms online, company Terms of Service and many other kinds of web content.  Give this embed below a click and see how it works.<br />
<center><iframe scrolling="no" frameborder="0" width="302px"  src="http://www.iterasi.net/embedded/?sqrlitid=voOkK0Fv0E-SLpXF2xKWNw"></iframe><center></p>

<p>Since I'm closer to this one than to many of the other apps here I can tell you it doesn't work as well yet as I wish it did, but it's coming along and has great potential.  I regularly find myself wishing the Mac version was done so I could capture a page on a site with a click.</p>

<p><em>Dapper</em></p>

<p><a href="http://dapper.net">Dapper</a> is another web app that pushes the limits of the browser.  It allows you to click to select any field on a web page and monitor that particular field for changes.  Changes are delivered by RSS.  The possibilities are endless.</p>

<center><a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/images/dapperrww.swf" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.readwriteweb.com/images/Picture%20191.png" width="325"></a></center>

<p>The company has a number of other data outputs available, but almost all of them are broken and not worth trying to use.  The company has recently struggled with some uptime issues as well.  When it works and your needs are technically simple, Dapper can make web pages do back flips for you.</p>

<h2>Conclusion</h2>

<p>All of the above have their shortcomings but they all also offer a new world of functionality, they open a new horizon beyond the limitations of loading and reading and writing single web pages at a time.</p>

<p>These are some of our favorite post-browser apps, what are some of yours?  We'd love to learn more about the bleeding edge of this kind of strategy.  These are really fun and useful ways to use our computers.</p>

<p><em>Rainbow image by <a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/7519597@N05/2466444043/">Cessna 206</a></em><br />
<script language="javascript" src="http://static.onfirefly.com/ff.js"></script> </p>]]>
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  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55472</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
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    <title>Comment from Mikael Bergkvist on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>Mikael Bergkvist</name>
        <uri>http://www.widgetplus.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.widgetplus.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>First, there was the browser, you enter an url, click 'go', and then you go there.<br />
Next is when applications decentralise so that wherever you go, there it is, on any website or blog, holding your personal data.<br />
This is where open social is going, and this is what we have come to know as 'widgets'.<br />
The step following this will invetiable be multiple apps that share your data.<br />
Imagine your startpage blown to pieces and when you surf the web and visit various sites, you find these pieces all over the place, depending on which site it is you currently visit.<br />
You drag an image to a widget on one site which sports collections of free images, and then you open all the images you have collected in another widget somewhere else, and create a slideshow out of them and save.<br />
Then, your online email allows you to open that slideshow from a third widget and embed it into the richly formatted email you send to someone.<br />
We have started to move in that direction already, and our company, <a href="http://www.widgetplus.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.widgetplus.com</a> , is adamantly pushing for that future to happen now, rather than later.<br />
</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-20T23:29:50Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55473</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55473" />
    <title>Comment from Marshall Kirkpatrick on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>Marshall Kirkpatrick</name>
        <uri></uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="">
        <![CDATA[<p>Oh, well I'm glad that after all the work I put into writing this post the first commenter took the time to write up a long...commercial for their app.  Charming.</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-20T23:33:44Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55477</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55477" />
    <title>Comment from Mikael Bergkvist on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>Mikael Bergkvist</name>
        <uri>http://www.widgetplus.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.widgetplus.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>It's not *commercial*, so that's not true, strictly speaking. :-/<br />
We dont charge anything, indirectly or otherwise, and we dont do ads, so there you go. </p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-20T23:52:58Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55478</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55478" />
    <title>Comment from BCK on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>BCK</name>
        <uri></uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="">
        <![CDATA[<p>FYI: Better Gmail was updated to Better Gmail 2, due to conflicts with Gmail (http://tinyurl.com/3x4ggz) Just a minor detail. Great Post!</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T00:03:53Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55479</id>
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    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55479" />
    <title>Comment from cease on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>cease</name>
        <uri></uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="">
        <![CDATA[<p>@Marshall Good article.. and yes the first commenter sucks.. hahaha..<br />
I'm most impressed by firefly.. that was very fun.<br />
Offline apps.. ehhh.. not so impressive, as a lot of us are becoming constantly connected one way or another. <br />
Desktop sites again.. ehhh.. I don't care for anything desktop, I prefer to use browser.. why change the experience for the user from going from desktop to web, and vice versa if you don't have to.  I don't like installing things, I don't like it using memory, cause more than likely I will have a browser open along with desktop app.. just use a tab in the browser its easier.  <br />
Enhancing with greasemonkey and flash overlay, is definitely the best solution to me. </p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T00:04:10Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55480</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55480" />
    <title>Comment from Jay Deragon on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>Jay Deragon</name>
        <uri>http://www.relationship-economy.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.relationship-economy.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>As usualy great reporting and comparisions.</p>

<p>I have just started using www.goyodeo.com as a broadcasting tool and the creators are adding functionality such as:</p>

<p>The Floating web app: the app floats with you as you surf the web in traditional ways</p>

<p>Integrated connections, blogs, micro blogging, search along with video broadcast.</p>

<p>I like where this is going since it is not tethered to any one web page and will enable me to manage all my "social" activities in one application.  I like the video capabilities including starting your own broadcast stations and channels where other users can add content to and rate the content as well.</p>

<p>Anyhow, worth checking out.  I created a brpacast message as a reply to all those I connect with and you can see it here <a href="http://goyodeo.com/channel?c=4YKHG5K4V1" rel="nofollow">http://goyodeo.com/channel?c=4YKHG5K4V1</a></p>

<p>ReadWriteWeb could actually become its own virtual broadcast staion providing reporting, interviews etc then launch the app virally.</p>

<p>Let me know what you think</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T00:26:56Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55481</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55481" />
    <title>Comment from Mikael Bergkvist on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>Mikael Bergkvist</name>
        <uri>http://www.widgetplus.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.widgetplus.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>"The Floating web app: the app floats with you as you surf the web in traditional ways"</p>

<p>That's a cool approach, and it's along the lines I speak of, where the web is kinda disintergrating / decentralising so specific topics are served from specific sites, but that there's a overall social context to the experience.<br />
The web is coming to you as much as you are coming to the web. </p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T00:33:00Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55482</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55482" />
    <title>Comment from atomic1fire on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>atomic1fire</name>
        <uri></uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="">
        <![CDATA[<p>Its not a commercial "strictly speaking"<br />
Its SPAM strictly speaking.<br />
when the comment space on all blogs is renamed to Your Ad Here then it will become a commercial.<br />
Comments are for comments, Not for commercials.<br />
</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T00:36:22Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55483</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55483" />
    <title>Comment from marcel weiss on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>marcel weiss</name>
        <uri>http://www.neunetz.com/</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.neunetz.com/">
        <![CDATA[<p>"about putting Google Reader in its own Single App Browser."<br />
I'm doing that for ages with mozillas prism. It's great. as fast as a desktop app.</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T00:51:10Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55486</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55486" />
    <title>Comment from Simon Gilligan on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>Simon Gilligan</name>
        <uri>http://applebox.com.au</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://applebox.com.au">
        <![CDATA[<p>A point I'd make is RIAs began as in-browser apps, and can be opened without the browser chrome to break free of the browser nav approach (ie urls).</p>

<p>Yep, AIR and Silverlight are taking RIAs in a particular direction, but plenty of action is still happening in html/js/css RIA world, and mozilla prism will add to their appeal by opening in standalone browser instances (finally, we can app-switch between browser apps).</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T01:21:44Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55487</id>
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    <title>Comment from Elias Holman on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>Elias Holman</name>
        <uri>http://distancesoftware.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://distancesoftware.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>Ultimately, I doubt many of these RIAs and single-app browsers will really get traction, given how loathe many are to open yet another app for some specific purpose.  I like the browser for many reasons, primarily that I already have it open so running a new application is as quick as opening a tab, and that it provides an implicit sandbox for applications so I have less concern about security than with implicitly-trusted desktop apps.  From the flip side, as an application developer, I can be nearly 100% certain that my user has a browser, but getting them to install another application adds an extra barrier to adoption that I can do without.  </p>

<p>For instance, Twhirl is a great twitter client, but it still has a measly 7% to the web's 56% (taken <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/top_twitter_clients_definitive_list.php" rel="nofollow">from RWW's own coverage</a>).  I would bet that if Twitter tried to kick things off with just something like Twhirl, it would have been much less successful.  My guess is that instead, like with the addition of XHR to browsers a few generations back unlocking a whole new suite of web application capabilities, browser developers will continue to try to extend the browser experience, as in FF3's offline capabilities, until the definition of the browser is much broader.</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T02:08:49Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55491</id>
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    <title>Comment from AvaD on 2008-05-20</title>
    <author>
        <name>AvaD</name>
        <uri></uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="">
        <![CDATA[<p>"These are some of our favorite post-browser apps, what are some of yours?"</p>

<p>Gabtastik -- SSB for Facebook Chat, Google Talk and meebo:<br />
<a href="http://www.gabtastik.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.gabtastik.com</a></p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T03:10:08Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55510</id>
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    <title>Comment from Jean-Marc Liotier on 2008-05-21</title>
    <author>
        <name>Jean-Marc Liotier</name>
        <uri>http://serendipity.ruwenzori.net/</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://serendipity.ruwenzori.net/">
        <![CDATA[<p>My first reaction when confronted with those applications is fear of getting carried away from the textual and interpreted nature of the web. More choice of clients is a good thing - and that does mean more specialized clients such as those applications besides the general purpose client that is the desktop web browser. But I hope that developers and operators alike don't forget that all-terrain data access through the lowest common denominator is a keystone of openness.<br />
</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T09:41:06Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55518</id>
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    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c55518" />
    <title>Comment from Faisal Riaz on 2008-05-21</title>
    <author>
        <name>Faisal Riaz</name>
        <uri>http://dogandbonegames.com/dogandbonegames/blog/index.php</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://dogandbonegames.com/dogandbonegames/blog/index.php">
        <![CDATA[<p>11.9 million Opera Mini users will have strong control to make choice.</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T11:51:13Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:55560</id>
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    <title>Comment from Richard Monson-Haefel on 2008-05-21</title>
    <author>
        <name>Richard Monson-Haefel</name>
        <uri>http://www.curl.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.curl.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>@Marshall</p>

<p>"Rich Internet Apps are applications that run on the desktop, outside of the browser, "</p>

<p>Actually what you describe are not RIA technologies. RIA technologies (e.g. Flash/Flex, Silverlight, Curl applets, Ajax) are bound to, and run in, the confines of the browser.  Applications that run outside the browser but offer web connectivity, web deployment, and web update are what some people call "Fit Client" platforms (aka Desktop 2.0, Desktop RIA).  </p>

<p>Examples of Fit Client technologies include Adobe AIR, Google Gears, Mozilla Prism, and Curl Nitro (note: I work for Curl, Inc.).  The term "Fit Client" itself came from Anne Thomas Manes of Burton Group.  I think it is the best term because things like AIR/Curl/Prism/Gears are somewhere between traditional client/server applications ("thick clients") and RIA and HTML clients ("thin clients").</p>

<p>Having said all that, I thought the article was actually very good and and does a great job of calling out non-traditional web technologies. </p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-21T19:06:25Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:56050</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
    <link rel="alternate" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php#c56050" />
    <title>Comment from d@vid seaward on 2008-05-26</title>
    <author>
        <name>d@vid seaward</name>
        <uri>http://inkwell.za.net/</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://inkwell.za.net/">
        <![CDATA[<p>@Richard M-H. Thanks for that clarification on different client types. I remember seeing some arguments about whether Adobe AIR and Mozilla Prism could even be compared, so this helps a bit.</p>

<p>I was disappointed that Firefly didn't work for me (the little orange box appeared but it complained about the connection). Oh well.</p>

<p>But it did somewhat remind me of PMOG, the Passively Multiplayer Online Game. It's basically a Firefox extension, so I'm not sure if it counts as post-browser. It runs like a computer roleplaying game, earning you points for every different domain you visit during the day. Occasionally you might wander across an item someone has left at a particular URL (which you can only see if you have the extension installed, of course).</p>

<p>The neat thing is that unlike typically online games that require time away from work or reading RWW articles, you can hide the extension and still earn points in the background and encounter enemy mines when you least expect it. Silly, fun and not addition to information overload :)</p>

<p><a href="http://www.pmog.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.pmog.com</a></p>

<p>Disclosure: I don't work for PMOG, but I really really like it :D</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-05-26T15:28:25Z</published>
  </entry>

  <entry>
    <id>tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356-comment:57003</id>
    <thr:in-reply-to ref="tag:www.readwriteweb.com,2008://1.6356" type="text/html" href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/post_browser_apps.php"/>
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    <title>Comment from Ryan Gahl on 2008-06-05</title>
    <author>
        <name>Ryan Gahl</name>
        <uri>http://www.nthpenguin.com</uri>
    </author>
    <content type="html" xml:lang="en" xml:base="http://www.nthpenguin.com">
        <![CDATA[<p>I would have to agree with the statement that RIAs are not necessarily apps that run outside of the browser. To me, when I build a long running complex single page AJAX application, that's an RIA. I could happen to use Flash/Flex, Silverlight, etc. technology for some snazzy elements if I wish... but combining great components in an intuitive interface that is responsive and requires no full page refreshing is really covering all the letters of the acronym, no matter whether it is consumed within a browser or in a pseudo-browser (AIR) context.</p>]]>
    </content>
    <published>2008-06-05T14:31:38Z</published>
  </entry>

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