Kevin Rose Apologizes for Sexist Joke on Diggnation
Digg founder Kevin Rose issued an apology this morning for statements he made on the latest edition of his video podcast Diggnation. Just after the 4 minute mark in the show Rose and co-host Alex Albrecht were making jokes about men getting into physical fights with women and Rose made a statement that a particular act of violence was appropriate as an act of retribution in some circumstances.
An excerpted transcript and the text of Rose's apology sent to us by email when we inquired this morning are below.
Rose said the following on Diggnation:
"there is only one time you can strike [a woman -] if she kicks you in the balls, you have the ability and the right, to punch her in the teat - it's just like that - it's kinda like tit for tat [Albrecht talks then Kevin again] It hurts them, it does too - or take a scissors to the teat" (Kevin makes cutting action with hand)
The part of the statement about cutting was offensive, juvenile and inappropriate, even in jest. It's sadistic and the double standard that society applies should be clear: if a woman went on Diggnation and talked about how it's ok to cut men's genitals with scissors that would be a very big deal to a lot of people.
It was also ironic given that Digg and Rose in particular had banned a number of Digg users last month for making offensive, sexist comments on a Digg post about an article in FastCompany by Saabira Chaudhuri about women in technology.
Rose sent the following reply this morning in response to our inquiry about the incident.
"I'd like to apologize for some comments I made in the latest episode of Diggnation, which came off as insensitive on the topic of violence towards women. Alex and I have always viewed Diggnation as an outlet to push the limits in a comedic fashion. Obviously, violence against women is serious and something we don't advocate in any way."
Why It's Not OK to Say Things Like This
We're glad Rose has publicly apologized for the inappropriate statement and hope that he'll act as a good role model for the many young people who watch his show. Violence against women is endemic around the world and the kind of violence that Rose joked about goes beyond self-defense and enters into the realm of all-too-real tragedy for many people. Pop-culture humor making light of such violence contributes to a cultural climate in which some people mistakenly consider this type or related behavior acceptable.
No one is perfect but when some lines are crossed it's important to discuss why such statements are inappropriate. We hope that Rose and Digg can continue working to make Digg, and the increasingly large part of the world that it influences, a better place. Anyone who reads the comments on the site regularly knows that both Digg and the world we live in have a long way to go. Censorship isn't necessarily the answer, but discussion, apologies when needed and not saying stupid things in the first place are probably big parts the best solution.
Comments
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Well, if you get kicked in your nuts real hard, it's quite a challenge to strike back anyhow. But still, it;s a dumb remark.
Posted by: lenen | November 24, 2008 12:00 PM
I have never hurt a woman and would not stand for anyone doing it but COME ON. I feel this post is a waste of space and it's about a "no issue". Diggnation is comedy, and it's a waste of time to apologize for something like that... I never saw Monty Python, south park, the Simpson etc apologize for anything. Come on people stop being hypocritical.
Posted by: Gonçalo Brito | November 24, 2008 12:16 PM
WTF? Why is this even an issue? Was this the first episode of Diggnation you've ever seen or something?
Posted by: Four20 | November 24, 2008 12:22 PM
WHO GIVES A RIP WHAT THESE PUNKS SAY.
IT'S MORE THAN INSENSITIVE TOWARDS WOMEN.
THEY ARE AN INSULT TO HUMAN INTELLIGENCE.
Posted by: DIPP FAQ | November 24, 2008 12:23 PM
Hm. I'm truly surprised that this comment made ripples and that Kevin felt prompted to give a (half-)apology. I've watched diggnation on and off over the years and Rose consistently makes humorless sexist comments in a way that Albrecht doesn't (and yet, Alex manages to be much funnier). He consistenly goes for the fratty-cum-nerdy territory, which feeds into the culture of Digg comments and adolecent internet culture at large. Just as digg isn't exactly a woman-friendly environment, diggnation is exactly a woman-friendly podcast. His comments are far from benign, but exist on a well-established--though notably unfortunate--continuum of gendered divisions at digg and in techie culture. News at 11, etc, etc.
Posted by: mabisa
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November 24, 2008 12:39 PM
thanks for the thoughtful comment Mabisa
Posted by: Marshall Kirkpatrick
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November 24, 2008 12:40 PM
Really? You took the time to turn this into an article? Besides, he was right....a kick to the nads is justified for a punch to the teats.
Posted by: Midway | November 24, 2008 1:01 PM
If Rose is going to apologize for that and still be on Diggnation, then I think the people that have been banned from Digg for the same reason should only have to apologize and be re-instated as well.
Posted by: SilentJay74 | November 24, 2008 1:28 PM
I doubt this should be an issue at all. Not funny but nothing more that the silly nonsense it was intended to be. Buy hey... I'm a guy. I guess that makes me insensitive. My wife thought it was funny. There must be something wrong with her. No, wait - there's something wrong with people who watch this stuff and then have the audacity to complain about it. Freedom of speech is just as powerful as your ability to watch something else. Get off some other way. Don't like Kevin, don't watch Kevin. It's a rather simple solution. If you're going to get offended easily you should still be listening to AM radio - you aren't ready for everything else the World has to offer.
Posted by: Ian Maffett | November 24, 2008 1:39 PM
It's not offensive at all. I actually agree with Kevin.
Posted by: Chris Jacobson | November 24, 2008 1:40 PM
wahh wahh wahh. STFU please. What a stupid post.
Posted by: KROD | November 24, 2008 1:43 PM
You guys in comments are wrong, this was a bad thing to say and that's why Rose apologized. Cutting a woman's nipples with scissors is sadistic, not funny. Why is that so hard to understand?
Marshall, what makes you so special? Why do you get to decide if someone's opinion on the matter is right or wrong? Frankly I don't think it deserved an apology and people are blowing this way out of proportion.
Posted by: chrrrr | November 24, 2008 1:47 PM
Guys? You're wrong, Marshall is right, Kevin's just trying to contain any damage to his company and probably doesn't mean any of that apology. And this is why I don't give a crap about Digg or the people on it. There's something very wearing about immature highschoolers and fratboys who never grow up and think it's fine to hit and hurt women. Go back to Digg and play with yourselves there, OK?
Posted by: rick | November 24, 2008 2:10 PM
I watch the show and saw the clip. What bothers me is this line in Kevin's apology: "Alex and I have always viewed Diggnation as an outlet to push the limits in a comedic fashion."
Kevin, I like your show but you and Alex (who has the most pitched, annoying voice ever) aren't pushing the limits of *anything.* You're two guys sitting on a couch talking about what's on the Internet. Wayne and Garth 2.0.
Posted by: Dale Cruse | November 24, 2008 2:23 PM
People are assholes. I'm not insinuating Mr. Rose is one, but he was joking (based on my observation of the video).
If this was a serious discussion and he got on there advocating Digg users cut their female friends (if they have them), I would fully support a post about it. But this? Not news. Not even of interest.
A post about a dumb video blog comment from an internet celebrity? That's interesting. I'm curious about the motivation beyond knee jerk shock.
Posted by: Brandon J. Mendelson | November 24, 2008 2:35 PM
Good thing, 'cause Digg's huge female user base could easily have jumped ship.
Posted by: Chris Baskind
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November 24, 2008 2:38 PM
I am always amazed how people do not care about violent comments against women, the best evidence are the comments on this post.
It is because violence against women is still acceptable in many places.
Talking about freedom of speech: Kevin Rose decided to apologize, no one forced him.
About "Blowing this out of proportion": if violence against women was not so preeminent on the planet, this topic would not be so sensitive, and making these kind of comments ok or "fun" makes the violence acceptable too.
Read on this UN web page to see that this topic is no joke:
http://www.unifem.org/campaign/vaw/facts_figures.php?page=2
Thanks for your article Marshall
Posted by: Eliane | November 24, 2008 2:43 PM
I appreciate the article, Marshall. Thanks for bringing it into light.
Posted by: Anna | November 24, 2008 3:00 PM
I'm sure you've threatened to kick a man in the genitals before, so the idea of Kevin "propagating violence against women" is as retarded as you propagating violence against men. It's as equally wrong, so stop taking his comments out of context and hanging him for it. I'm sure he in no way meant that.
However, the problem is the medium in which he chose to be silly. Unfortunately, this proves that Kevin and Alex no longer have the freedom to say whatever they want. Just the fact that Kevin apologized proves that they're now accountable for every childish thing they say, which makes the show funny. On the other hand, you've validated this video podcast as having a great effect on the perception of women in the internet's public eye... would you complain if they got a scantily-clad female assistant to help them out on the show? Would that be degrading?
Bottomline: This is only offensive because you chose to take offense. The majority of the Diggnation audience obviously doesn't mind Kevin and Alex's judgment on choosing their comments, as it's probably the most popular vidcast on the internet. After all, YOU decided to validate it as a large player in women's rights on the web...
Posted by: JB | November 24, 2008 3:16 PM
C'mon... isn't it reverse sexism to assume that a woman can nail you in the balls and she is immune from retribution due to her womanliness? It was made very clear that hitting a woman would be a proper response only AFTER SHE initiated the violence. It wasn't 'well if I wanted to hurt a woman the way I would do it is to hit her on the teats...'
Grow up... It's like calling someone a potential murderer for saying that if they had had the chance to kill Mao, Hitler, Stalin, Amin, etc that they would have.
Posted by: Leo | November 24, 2008 3:40 PM
its frightening to think that joking about such violence is still done so casually. theres a reason we have so many battered women's shelters in this country, and its due in part to such a complacent and accepting attitude towards such language. its real, and its effective.
http://www.asafeplaceforhelp.org/batteredwomenstatistics.html
Posted by: matt | November 24, 2008 4:26 PM
@leo - yeah, slashing her tits with scissors is easily fair retribution for getting kicked in the nuts. if you got kicked in the nuts, you probably deserved it in the first place. in fact, why dont you just rape her -- that will *really* show her how vulnerable her "womanness" is.
any by your logic, why dont you just go ahead and rape her. she *may have* kicked you in the balls if you didnt.
Posted by: matt | November 24, 2008 4:28 PM
Who gives a shit? A bitch kicks in you the balls, you have the right do fucking hit her back. End of story. Fuck the double standards of society. If she's strong enough to start a fight, she's strong enough to take a punch.
Posted by: Jack Mehoffer | November 24, 2008 4:33 PM
Dear Mr. Kirkpatrick
lighten the fuck up! Thank you
the internet
Posted by: wtf | November 24, 2008 4:36 PM
You want to talk about double standard? I can't see anyone flinching if the host had been female and said something like, "The man would deserve to have his balls cut off."
Get over it.
Posted by: Greg | November 24, 2008 4:36 PM
just because someone makes a joke, you dont have to take it as face value! do u think someone would actually cut a womens tits off???
lets make a story out of nothing...
people need to unloosen their belt, and take a chill pill
Posted by: u guys are everything that is wrong with society | November 24, 2008 4:38 PM
you need to lighten up, jerkwad. people like you are the reason the world is such a retarded place right now, and the reason kids can't be kids anymore.
rtard
Posted by: Nick | November 24, 2008 4:40 PM
A stupid remark, it would have been ok if he had just stopped short of the scissors joke - but he pushed it a bit with that. I'm not saying we should all go crazy, but it does show a level of immaturity you wouldn't expect from someone headlining a media empire (revision 3 / digg).
Psychologically he may have some awkward ill feelings towards woman that he's closeted. But then again that's much of the Digg userbase.
Posted by: Mobile ANswers | November 24, 2008 4:43 PM
Um... Women have been fighting for decades fro equality. Why is it they get so mad when we give it to them. If a woman punched me in the face, Id punch her face right back. There is your equality. Or is it equality in only the things they want and not in the things they dont want.
Posted by: Anon | November 24, 2008 4:43 PM
Um... Women have been fighting for decades for equality. Why is it they get so mad when we give it to them. If a woman punched me in the face, Id punch her face right back. There is your equality. Or is it equality in only the things they want and not in the things they dont want.
Posted by: womensuck | November 24, 2008 4:45 PM
This is a nothing story. He probably shouldn't have said it but its not worth the paragraphs wasted on it. Next article: Kevin Rose pushes kid on playground.
Posted by: Amaranthisasin | November 24, 2008 4:45 PM
Are kidding me? Why don't you find something real to complain about like actual violence against women it was obvious it was a joke and if anyone actually took it seriously they are deranged and beyond help anyway.
Out of context yes its a terrible thing to say but it was joke lighten up a bit.
Posted by: What | November 24, 2008 4:47 PM
Can't believe you took the time to make this an article. Don't know if you've seen the show or not, but Diggnation is more comedy than anything else, and it has an Explicit tag in the iTunes store.
Waste of time and disk space.
Posted by: Mike | November 24, 2008 4:47 PM
Sooo, punching a women in the teat is actually OK?
Would it be OK, then, for woman to go on DIGG and talk about kicking a man in the balls?
What is it about violence with scissors that warrants this type of enforcement that violence with a fist just doesn't seem to warrant?
I would argue that this is actually an issue of aesthetics. People just don't like the cutting imagery and they don't go on DIGG for snuff-film level violent images.
So let's be clear - Rose is really apologizing for having bad taste.
Posted by: pffft | November 24, 2008 4:48 PM
Do you seriously think that a joke perpetuates violence?
You know, guys get beat up by other guys all the time too. Far more often than women get beat up. But nobody in the world would care if the joke was about guys kicking each other in the groin.
Posted by: MD | November 24, 2008 4:48 PM
For christ sakes Marshall. You sound like the biggest wuss in the world. It was a freaking joke. Look at what has become of a lot of us males in America. We've been turned into wusses by the feminist agenda. "We're glad Rose has publicly apologized for the inappropriate statement and hope that he'll act as a good role model for the many young people who watch his show." YUUUUUCKK.
Posted by: Gustav | November 24, 2008 4:49 PM
"If a woman went on Diggnation and talked about how it's ok to cut men's genitals with scissors that would be a very big deal to a lot of people."
No, it wouldn't. If she said it jokingly, like Kevin did, everyone would find it hilarious. Kevin's statement was offensive, but no double standard is at work here.
Posted by: Nick | November 24, 2008 4:51 PM
While I'm in general agreement with your position--that is, that the comment was offensive and inappropriate, I think you've got one thing completely backwards: a woman making a joke in poor taste about cutting off a man's balls and/or penis would pass completely without comment. How often did we hear Bobbit jokes in the couple of years following that incident?
Posted by: Bjorn | November 24, 2008 4:56 PM
Thank god for your article!
I was lead to believe that violence to women was A-OK because of his comments. Thank god for you bringing up such a huge issue whereby thousands of men would start to abuse women because of the comments.
What a wonderful day for equality!
Posted by: Andy | November 24, 2008 4:59 PM
Jesus, no one thinks that it is okay to stab a woman in her breast. Obviously, jokes are only funny when they meet your standards, don't offend you in any way, and are safe for everyone.
People like Marshall are the same lot who destroyed Henry Miller's career in an hail storm of overreaction. Marshall, please learn to differentiate between seriousness and jokes and, when you learn how a joke operates, try your hardest not to spew calls for censorship.
YOU ARE WRONG. Mainly because you obviously don't get that jokes are, this may surprise you, not to be taken seriously.
Was his joke tasteless? Sure. Was it immature? Indeed. Should he have to apologize to you (Marshall, your name does not sound female) because he hurt your feelings? No.
Dennis Leary was right: "Get a fucking helmet." Trust me, bub, if this bothers you, I would hate to see your reaction to the homeless man on the corner using your car as a urinal.
Posted by: Adrian | November 24, 2008 5:03 PM
This is funny. I didn't even know Digg had a founder.
Posted by: Mstov | November 24, 2008 5:03 PM
Dear sir, it's politically correct uptight prigs such as you who've cast a pall over much of our modern culture, and turned it into a humorless and restrictive echo chamber obsessed with oppression, group responsibility, power relations, etc. It's quite obvious from the context of the comment that it was meant as a joke, as are most comments women make about cutting someone's balls off. Obviously, such violence in a serious context is no joke, nor is slamming a foot into a man's genitals. And yet, as adults, can we not easily discern intent, and respond accordingly. Please get off of your high horse and relax a little.
Posted by: Jambi | November 24, 2008 5:04 PM
Look, there's a difference between saying if a woman kicks you in the balls you can hit back, and what was actually said, that if a woman kicks you in the balls, you should cut off her breast.
I'm not a woman and I still find the comment disgusting. I guess I don't get the "joke".
Posted by: WillJ | November 24, 2008 5:05 PM
Jesus fucking christ you self righteous prick, don't you have better things to do than throw a spaz fit over somebody saying something somewhat offensive that isn't even the worst thing they've said on a telecast watched by about as many people as the population of Wasilla, Alaska? What the hell makes you the guv'nor of what's ok to say in front of people? Especially when the only thing you say in your defense is simply "YOU'RE WRONG". For a techy, you seem to have a handicapped grasp of reasoning. What you, or I, or Kevin Rose says anywhere has no significant effect whatsoever on what anybody thinks. Nor is it a reflection of what they personally endorse -- not unless Kevin Rose turns out to be a serial rapist with a fetish for cutting off teets. OMG, did I just go there?
Politically correct fucks like you make me want to go rape women.
yours truly,
extremely offensive and politically incorrect
Posted by: lol | November 24, 2008 5:08 PM
Ahh thought police. Joke cops. Can you please make out a list of things that won't offend you all the people on the internet. Ooops can't joke anymore. Here's one. F off. Why is it that joking about something sparks such quotes as "I didn't know violence against women was ok". How idiotic. So now he's promoting violence against women? Guess there was no context other than that quote. Don't read moby dick the book as it 1 says dick in the title and you won't be able to follow it. It's called comedy. Whether you like it or not that's their goal. you can be of the opinion that it is not comedy and that's your right. But to say that YOU somehow shouldn't be offended or for you to be offended is something that a gnat would care about....you are so so wrong. I loath people that get offended by free speach. That's what makes this country great. As long as it's not saying " I will cut (your name inserted)'s teet then all is fair... Why does this comment actually affect you? Are you so small minded that you must force your ideals upon everyone else?
Posted by: sanstrom | November 24, 2008 5:13 PM
Enough with the phony outrage, ENOUGH. Kevin Rose comment was not "propagating violence against women" nor was it "sexist".
breathtaking inanity, this entire post and web site is breathtaking inanity.
Posted by: wat | November 24, 2008 5:23 PM
Go easy on Marshall. It wasn't like he was getting upset or making too big an issue out of this. He simply stated the facts and then said where he stood on the issue. It's not like he really gave Kevin a hard time about it. Sheesh.
And another thing. You can't simply "reverse" a comment to prove a point. Comments about certain segments of society that are vulnerable or historically targeted are different that comments about the white male heterosexual establishment.
It's about power.
(I'm tired I hope that made sense.)
Posted by: Markus | November 24, 2008 5:26 PM
markus,
No what you said doesn't make any sense at all. So you are saying you can't make a joke about something and expect people to take you seriously? What downtrodden are you talking about? Power? Are you kidding me? Get your garbage out of here. You seem to be a reverse racist. It's ok to make this joke about a hetero whiteman but not say a minority woman? Poppycock.... Look who we just elected president. If you keep pushing this crap see where you get in life. "It's over Johnny"
Posted by: sanstrom | November 24, 2008 5:32 PM
Thanks for posting this piece, Marshall. You seem to have struck a nerve amongst those who think jokes about violence toward women have a place in discourse. What that shows me is that we are a long way to ending such.
Posted by: Kathleen | November 24, 2008 5:32 PM
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