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Twine Launches 1.0 Version - Eyes Facebook, Google Reader, Delicious, Digg, ...

Written by Richard MacManus / October 20, 2008 9:00 PM / 15 Comments

When Twine announced itself to the world exactly one year ago, it claimed to be "the first mainstream Semantic Web application". However despite raising millions of dollars in its quest to bring the Semantic Web to the mainstream, Twine has been beset by usability and performance issues in its beta period. Our own Marshall Kirkpatrick wrote probably the most brutal review. The post title said it all: Twine Disappoints After Semantic Web Hype.

However Twine has just launched publicly, confident that it is ready for prime time. I spoke with Twine founder and Semantic Web proponent Nova Spivack today to find out what's changed, who's been using Twine up till now, and where the service is headed in the future.

Growing Pains

When I met Nova Spivack one year ago in San Francisco, Twine was still in a private beta. Spivack described Twine to us at that point as a "knowledge networking" application with aspects of social networking, wikis, blogging, knowledge management systems. All built with Semantic Web technologies. It sounded exciting, potentially revolutionary.

The problem though, as we found out when we actually got our hands on the product, was that the theory and hype hadn't translated into a usable app. Marshall identified major shortcomings in usability and performance. For example he explained that the service "doesn't consistently grab summary text or tags for pages you save in Twine, it doesn't recognize article authors as relevant people and it often captures summary information about the domain you're on instead of a particular page's content."

In a word, Twine felt "half baked" in March '07 according to our review of the product.

That Was Then, This is Now...

Unsurprisingly, in our interview today Nova Spivack was at pains to say that both usability and speed of the system have been improved for the 1.0 launch. Spivack told us that the main focus of this release is usability. Twine claims it has implemented "major performance fixes", which Spivack said has resulted in "very dramatic speed-ups". He explained that Twine has implemented caching on a lot of features, except for some of the more personal unique ones such as 'My Items' and general search.

Twine is also being re-marketed now as an "interest network" and not just a social network or bookmarking system. Part of the 1.0 launch is a new feature called an "interest feed". Spivack told us that "interest tracking" can start from importing your bookmarks (from e.g. delicious) and users (from e.g. Yahoo Mail). From there Twine's recommendation algorithm will find more items and people of interest - it apparently looks at your social graph, which "twines" you join (i.e. groups of topical interest), and other semantic data that Twine can surface. From there Twine automatically creates "semantic tags" and mines data to expand your 'interest network'.

Spivack said that in the next 2-3 weeks Twine will release "next gen crawling and mining", which will allow the system to index "pockets of the web" for you. As an example, Twine will index all the links and data in the first page of a website that you add to the system.

The Numbers & Demographics

How has Twine performed in its 1-year closed beta? Here are some interesting details about usage so far:

We were told that Twine has had 500,000 unique visitors in its closed beta, of which 50,000 are currently "active". I asked how they define active: in this case it means a user who visits the Twine site at least once per month.

There are currently 20,000 'twines', with 1 million pieces of content having been added to the system. 50% of the twines are private - Spivack said that many of those belong to companies ranging from small businesses to large corporations. Of the public twines, they range from people who use them for bookmarking and hobbies, to people who use twines as a kind of blog (e.g. Nova himself does this), to "cool hunters" (kind of like BoingBoing).

The most popular twines reflect the early adopter audience: cool stuff, semantic web, politics, web industry news, etc.

The average age of a Twine user is 30 yrs, and they tend to be young professionals with medium-to-high income and education. They've used the product for both professional and personal reasons. 50% of users come from outside the US, but the service is primarily english language. Spivack told us that currently they provide basic level support for other languages, but this will be enhanced over time.

User engagement is currently at 12 minutes per session, which Twine says is "trending upward" (it started out as 6 mins). By comparison we were told that Digg is 2.5 mins, StumbleUpon 5.5 mins and Facebook 15 minutes - all according to Compete.com data.

What's Next?

In terms of Twine's roadmap, in 2008 their focus is on usability - which Spivack says is "currently 80% there". In 2009 they will focus more on "surfacing the semantics", meaning improving recommendations, search, and adding support for more kinds of data (e.g. currently users can add YouTube videos, but not all video sites are supported).

Spivack said that in '09 users will be able to bring RSS into Twine (creating "a Reader on steriods"). Also users will be able to import emails. Twine hopes to data mine all of this.

And in 2009 an API is coming to Twine.

Monetizing Twine - Beacon-Like System Coming

Perhaps most intriguingly, Twine is planning to implement a new type of monetization system in 2009. Spivack had a big claim for this: "Twine will be for marketing what google is for advertising" (!). He said it will be the semantic equivalent of Google's Adwords, but for marketers.

The system he described sounded similar to Facebook's Beacon, in that it will insert marketing recommendations into the core content. Essentially marketers will be able to post things into Twine, targeted to users interests. Twine will make recommendations in users interest feeds and some of this will be sponsored. Spivack says Twine has some patents around new metrics for this - they'll be able to see (in aggregate only) what people are doing with their content.

From the description, this sounds very similar to Facebook's controversial Beacon, which was panned for infringing on users privacy. However Spivack claims it is "quite different from Beacon". He also said it will be a CPA not CPM model.

It remains to be seen how this system will work and whether users will have reason to be up in arms. But given that social networks are so hard to monetize and CPM is under pressure right now from the economic situation, the Web industry is in need of innovative solutions. So this will be something to watch closely.

So, Will You Use Twine?

I have been an irregular user of Twine since joining the beta earlier this year. I've saved some bookmarks into Twine as a substitute for Delicious, but I tend to go back to Delicious for most of my bookmarks. For my purposes, Delicious is simpler. One issue that Twine has is that it tries to do an awful lot, which has the risk of confusing users.

Nova Spivack is pretty direct when talking about competing with other products. About Delicious he claimed that the ROI of putting things in Twine is better than Delicious - and it will get higher over time. At various stages in the interview he also said that Twine "can do better than google reader" (as an RSS Reader) and it is better than StumbleUpon, Digg, Facebook.

Nova Spivack can talk a very good talk - and I admire his passion for the Semantic Web and vision for his product. But for Twine to succeed, it needs to do the core things well. Behind all the talk about Semantic Web, beating Adwords and being better than Delicious, Google Reader and so on... is a product that basically is a knowledge management application. Can Twine find enough mainstream users interested in that core functionality? Only time will tell.

I for one will be giving it another go, if only because if Twine does fulfil its hype and becomes the first mainstream Semantic Web app - then it would be embarassing if I missed out on it.


Comments

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  1. Well written with good background, Richard. Nice job.

    Posted by: Louis Gray Posted on FriendFeed   | October 20, 2008 9:33 PM



  2. I wouldn't be surprised to see Twine succeed as a platform rather than as an application per se.

    I personally believe that Twine's greatest strength is with its core semweb technologies, not necessarily with usability. However, this means that Twine can already serve as a semweb platform. Also, usability can get more attention now that core semweb issues have been furthered.

    Some people want to fly through their Twines, things like this. (Maybe Twine's a wee bit too early for transhumanism dreamers.) But there are many steps along the way -- with UXD -- that Twine/RN can bring to their party over the next year.

    Posted by: David Scott Lewis | October 20, 2008 9:44 PM



  3. I just don't see the use. I need a webapp to remind me of the things I like? Recommendation looks promising but is it worth the effort? I'm sure the technology behind it is impressive but at first glance it doesn't look like anything different or ground breaking.

    Posted by: Mike | October 20, 2008 10:27 PM



  4. @David
    "Fly through their twines"
    hehe.
    Good line. I have seen that spirit building up in there too...

    Posted by: Aldo Bucchi Posted on FriendFeed   | October 20, 2008 10:41 PM



  5. Additional value as compared to current bookmarking sites is very less, recommendation engine is not even close to being accurate.
    I wont agree that the usability is 80% there...its like google's marissa mayer saying search is 90% solved

    Posted by: Sumeet | October 20, 2008 11:28 PM



  6. I do not think that it will ever become mainstream

    Posted by: Yakov | October 21, 2008 12:44 AM



  7. First. I already use the network feature in del.icio.us and FriendFeed w/ numerous services, including Google Reader, last.fm, Flickr, Goodreads, Twitter, reddit, Flickr... FriendFeed gets it right, as far as I am concerned. It gets out of the way and lets the content streams flow. Twine, not so much.

    Second, monetization fail: "The system he described sounded similar to Facebook's Beacon, in that it will insert marketing recommendations into the core content." You don't do that, ever. Or, you do and I don't show up. Watch me shrug.

    Posted by: A Temporary Identity | October 21, 2008 1:39 AM



  8. Can somebody explain to me how Twine is different from creating channels in LiveJournal or groups on FaceBook? The same knowledge aggregation mechanism, innit?

    Posted by: Dmitry Paranyushkin Posted on FriendFeed   | October 21, 2008 4:58 AM



  9. Twine tries to do too many things at the same time, and as a result is not doing ANYTHING particularly well


    1) personalisation/recommendation/filtering

    haven't got any benefit from Twine. The twines are still more like topic specific newsgroups / mail lists that you *pull* from, instead of something that is *pushed* based on your preferences/history/tags/etc


    2) semantic web

    ummm... how exactly are semantic technologies used in Twine?

    Is it in recognising the names of people, organisations and places? Lightweight Named Entity Recognition / Information Extraction has been around since the 80-ties and Twine doesn't even do it well! (For Twine "Microsoft" is not the same as "Microsoft Corporation" and also "Yahoo" and "Yahoo!" are two different organisations)


    "The graph in Twine runs on a custom-designed software platform that is fundamentally based on RDF and OWL, the open-standard languages of the Semantic Web."

    so Twine is using neither OWL, nor RDF?

    Is Twine analysing the "semantic graph" at all, if it still cannot map "Microsoft Corporation" to "Microsoft" and "Yahoo" and "Yahoo!" (for which, by the way, you don't even need semantic web technologies), or is it just using it as a "fundamentally based on RDF and OWL" serialisation format, just as you can use XML


    3) Usability "currently 80% there"

    wow, and this is supposed to describe a bookmarklet which expects me to type the same tags AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN...

    Posted by: Twine user | October 21, 2008 5:41 AM



  10. Yawn. If Nova was able to create value as well as he can blabber then maybe Twine would be interesting.

    Until then. Yawn. Blah blah blah.

    Posted by: Stu Barnes | October 21, 2008 7:44 AM



  11. I have been using Twine for a few weeks now, and it is a bit difficult to see any semantic web there. I just hope that the internal representation of their data is not RDF, since RDF databases will not scale.

    Posted by: jack | October 21, 2008 1:48 PM



  12. The Semantic Hype? Seems like a shiny new way of giving us what we already get from other, non-semantic services. Who does the semantic web benefit anyway? Users? ...or tech nerds and bloggers who just like to be excited.

    Posted by: chris | October 21, 2008 6:33 PM



  13. The problem with Twine is that it doesnt live up to the visions. Its more simple than it first looks.

    The interest feed , for example, is nothing more than .. a feed. Like reading som rss-channels in a rss-reader.

    The comment-system is as confusing as it was several month ago. Theres still missing basic functions in editing, viewing and sorting your content. The kayout are also still too clumsy, not giving the user overview. The ability to give relevant tag suggestions isnt there.

    Also the site is still very buggy and slow. Last two days I get errors several times when trying to save an URL.

    It have potential, yes. It have had that for a long time now. I hoped Twine to be a creative hybrid between personal bookmarking, notetaking/ minwiki/ blog/ social bookmarking/ news/recommendation-service - but right now its still something distant, and maybe Twine with time can grow into something useful. But today it isnt.

    Posted by: sartro | October 24, 2008 11:51 AM



  14. the website seems a bit complicated to me. but, as a web 2.0 poet, i feel obligated to keep experimenting and absorbing the full twine-y experience. maybe i will get used to it. ;)

    here is what i wrote so far - http://web-poet.com/2008/10/24/the-big-knot/

    Posted by: Web Laureate | October 24, 2008 11:26 PM



  15. @sartro Yes, it sure seems that Twine is running on hype alone.

    Posted by: twine | October 27, 2008 9:38 AM



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